Besides being more rugged there are a lot of features built in that you'd never find on either a desktop or a work station. Memory mirroring, RAID memory, hot swap memory, hot swap PCI-X or -E cards, L4 cache built onto the cpu boards, main memory on each cpu board, slots for more than one memory card, choice of 2 or 4-way interleave on main memory, ChipKill on the cpu boards, N+1 hot swap power supplies, hot swap fans, connectors for adding external PCI enclosures, 2-12 (or more)hot swap drive bays built in, ......
Don't forget the painfully loud fans. Packing enough cooling air flow into a tight shape means absolute horror. Forget 120mm, 90mm, or even 80 mm fans rotating at the modest speeds required for decent acoustic noise. Say hello to tiny fans turning horribly fast, with the sound to match.
Oh, yes, conservative server design dictates that the supplied fans should be enough for reliable operation even after a failure (maybe more than one failure), so the required rotation speed or number of fans is even worse than you thought.
I'd not share my living space with one voluntarily, at work or at home.
Actually, that depends. Some of the tower-case servers don't sound too bad. But, I have a quartet of rack-mount SGI 1200 servers that are quite noisy. Each one sounds like a Cessna getting ready for take-off.
My dual quad core Mac Pro, which I assume is a server type mobo etc, is very quite even though it does put out some heat. It has been crunching E@H 24/7 since I got it in August of 2007 as a birthday present to myself. It is a tower / desktop case which appears to be more spacious than some of the rack mount server cases. The extra space might help cooling and require less fan speed.
Just wanted to say that not all servers are high decibel machines. :}
In the case of the rack mounts, well, those same chips can be stuffed in cases that are only a couple inches wide ... hence the small and louder fans.
BTW, I love my Mac Pro wish I could afford another ... though it would not have what I put into this one ... for one thing, I would not need a second screen ...
THough I doubt my power could take another like it along with the other machines I have here in the room ... sigh, need to get the electrician back out here ...
If you want to hear one howl try a pair of 150mm x 51mm redundant fans for cooling the cpu boards and a pair of 150mm x 38mm side by side fans for cooling the PCI section. Add to that a pair of 60mm fan for each of the two power supplies. On a hot day with all the fans running wide open it sounds like an F4 in max AB.
Considered putting a handle and some wheels on it and using it to clean the carpet! :)
Actually, that depends. Some of the tower-case servers don't sound too bad. But, I have a quartet of rack-mount SGI 1200 servers that are quite noisy. Each one sounds like a Cessna getting ready for take-off.
Thanks for pointing out my error. I was over-general in using the term "server". Yes, I was thinking of the rack-mount sort, and more particularly the ones that fit in a 1U vertical spacing. With only 1.75" stacking height, fans in those things are necessarily tiny, and I think my comments apply.
1U types are far, far indeed from being all servers.
On the other hand, I do think that even in more generous packaging, the design tradeoff between acoustic noise and reliability probably tends toward noisier servers on average than roughly comparable designs aimed at office or residential use.
I've visited computer rooms since the mid 1960's. Every one I've ever visited has had a loud background fan noise. Even the clatter of chain printer hammers did not drown out the fan noise.
Being able to run BOINC at work on "servers" is great.....so typically - noise and power consumption / air conditioning are not an issue.
But not all of us have that option.
I have had everything from piles of dual P3 slot1 systems to several Compaq and Dell 8xcpu servers to a full 42u rack with dual Xeon Nocona systems.
All running in my garage, its great watching the cumulative production....but the noise and heat and relative PITA factor not to mention the peaked $465.oo dollar electric bill.
I have found that is far more effective and efficient to invest in new hardware.
Not always the newest hardware, but great production can be had with slightly behind the curve equipment.
We all know good crunchers dont have to be the newest 5400 xeons but a basic q6600 desktop or even dual C2D xeon systems can be built and are very productive.
For example, my newest cruncher is a Opteron 1218 system for under 300.
Playing around on Dells site, some decent dual proc systems can be had at relatively competitive prices with a warranty and service.
As a fellow cruncher learned...The added benefit of the 3 year warranty is plus if your mobo gives up the ghost.
*cough* JR *cough*
I look forward to the Nehalam line....and dream of building up dual 8 core system.
I look forward to the Nehalam line....and dream of building up dual 8 core system.
Indeed.
Now, did I get this right? According to their roadmap, AMD does not have anything in the pipeline to challenge Nehalem in 2009, and probably not even in the first half of 2010, if at all in 2010??? Intel will have to come to the rescue of AMD just like Microsoft did with Apple to avoid a monopoly situation, if this goes on like this...
I look forward to the Nehalam line....and dream of building up dual 8 core system.
Indeed.
Now, did I get this right? According to their roadmap, AMD does not have anything in the pipeline to challenge Nehalem in 2009, and probably not even in the first half of 2010, if at all in 2010??? Intel will have to come to the rescue of AMD just like Microsoft did with Apple to avoid a monopoly situation, if this goes on like this...
CU
Bikeman
That remains to be seen. According to The Inquirer, AMD have just announced plans to build 6-core and 12-core processors over the next couple of years. The big question is, will they be able to do that before they run out of money?
I'd like to see AMD survive, so that Intel can have some decent competition. But, sadly, AMD have made a few bad moves over the last few years--namely, their deal with Dell, their purchase of ATI, and their botched Barcelona launch. Hopefully, they can get back on track soon.
That remains to be seen. According to The Inquirer, AMD have just announced plans to build 6-core and 12-core processors over the next couple of years. The big question is, will they be able to do that before they run out of money?
I'd like to see AMD survive, so that Intel can have some decent competition.
...
Yes, but the 6- and 12-core CPUs are still K10 based. K10 Quadcores do not get close to Core architecture quads, so I doubt the new AMD multicores will be able to compete with Nehalem 8 cores, performance-wise. But there's hope AMD will find a way to survive until they catch up, as they did in the past.
That remains to be seen. According to The Inquirer, AMD have just announced plans to build 6-core and 12-core processors over the next couple of years. The big question is, will they be able to do that before they run out of money?
I'd like to see AMD survive, so that Intel can have some decent competition.
...
Yes, but the 6- and 12-core CPUs are still K10 based. K10 Quadcores do not get close to Core architecture quads, so I doubt the new AMD multicores will be able to compete with Nehalem 8 cores, performance-wise. But there's hope AMD will find a way to survive until they catch up, as they did in the past.
CU
Bikeman
Yeah, the AMD folk recognize that K10 doesn't have the same performance level as Core. That was one of their reasons for cancelling their planned eight-core processors, and moving to 12-core. Will even that help? At this point, who knows?
RE: RE: Besides being
)
Actually, that depends. Some of the tower-case servers don't sound too bad. But, I have a quartet of rack-mount SGI 1200 servers that are quite noisy. Each one sounds like a Cessna getting ready for take-off.
My dual quad core Mac Pro,
)
My dual quad core Mac Pro, which I assume is a server type mobo etc, is very quite even though it does put out some heat. It has been crunching E@H 24/7 since I got it in August of 2007 as a birthday present to myself. It is a tower / desktop case which appears to be more spacious than some of the rack mount server cases. The extra space might help cooling and require less fan speed.
Just wanted to say that not all servers are high decibel machines. :}
The Mac Pro also has VERY
)
The Mac Pro also has VERY LARGE fans ...
And the case is quite large and empty...
In the case of the rack mounts, well, those same chips can be stuffed in cases that are only a couple inches wide ... hence the small and louder fans.
BTW, I love my Mac Pro wish I could afford another ... though it would not have what I put into this one ... for one thing, I would not need a second screen ...
THough I doubt my power could take another like it along with the other machines I have here in the room ... sigh, need to get the electrician back out here ...
If you want to hear one howl
)
If you want to hear one howl try a pair of 150mm x 51mm redundant fans for cooling the cpu boards and a pair of 150mm x 38mm side by side fans for cooling the PCI section. Add to that a pair of 60mm fan for each of the two power supplies. On a hot day with all the fans running wide open it sounds like an F4 in max AB.
Considered putting a handle and some wheels on it and using it to clean the carpet! :)
RE: Actually, that depends.
)
Thanks for pointing out my error. I was over-general in using the term "server". Yes, I was thinking of the rack-mount sort, and more particularly the ones that fit in a 1U vertical spacing. With only 1.75" stacking height, fans in those things are necessarily tiny, and I think my comments apply.
1U types are far, far indeed from being all servers.
On the other hand, I do think that even in more generous packaging, the design tradeoff between acoustic noise and reliability probably tends toward noisier servers on average than roughly comparable designs aimed at office or residential use.
I've visited computer rooms since the mid 1960's. Every one I've ever visited has had a loud background fan noise. Even the clatter of chain printer hammers did not drown out the fan noise.
Being able to run BOINC at
)
Being able to run BOINC at work on "servers" is great.....so typically - noise and power consumption / air conditioning are not an issue.
But not all of us have that option.
I have had everything from piles of dual P3 slot1 systems to several Compaq and Dell 8xcpu servers to a full 42u rack with dual Xeon Nocona systems.
All running in my garage, its great watching the cumulative production....but the noise and heat and relative PITA factor not to mention the peaked $465.oo dollar electric bill.
I have found that is far more effective and efficient to invest in new hardware.
Not always the newest hardware, but great production can be had with slightly behind the curve equipment.
We all know good crunchers dont have to be the newest 5400 xeons but a basic q6600 desktop or even dual C2D xeon systems can be built and are very productive.
For example, my newest cruncher is a Opteron 1218 system for under 300.
Playing around on Dells site, some decent dual proc systems can be had at relatively competitive prices with a warranty and service.
As a fellow cruncher learned...The added benefit of the 3 year warranty is plus if your mobo gives up the ghost.
*cough* JR *cough*
I look forward to the Nehalam line....and dream of building up dual 8 core system.
RE: I look forward to the
)
Indeed.
Now, did I get this right? According to their roadmap, AMD does not have anything in the pipeline to challenge Nehalem in 2009, and probably not even in the first half of 2010, if at all in 2010??? Intel will have to come to the rescue of AMD just like Microsoft did with Apple to avoid a monopoly situation, if this goes on like this...
CU
Bikeman
RE: RE: I look forward
)
That remains to be seen. According to The Inquirer, AMD have just announced plans to build 6-core and 12-core processors over the next couple of years. The big question is, will they be able to do that before they run out of money?
I'd like to see AMD survive, so that Intel can have some decent competition. But, sadly, AMD have made a few bad moves over the last few years--namely, their deal with Dell, their purchase of ATI, and their botched Barcelona launch. Hopefully, they can get back on track soon.
RE: That remains to be
)
Yes, but the 6- and 12-core CPUs are still K10 based. K10 Quadcores do not get close to Core architecture quads, so I doubt the new AMD multicores will be able to compete with Nehalem 8 cores, performance-wise. But there's hope AMD will find a way to survive until they catch up, as they did in the past.
CU
Bikeman
RE: RE: That remains to
)
Yeah, the AMD folk recognize that K10 doesn't have the same performance level as Core. That was one of their reasons for cancelling their planned eight-core processors, and moving to 12-core. Will even that help? At this point, who knows?