I wonder those who argued that the optimized applications were still OK to run will change their mind now that Bernard has stated it is causing problems, and has more or less asked people to stop
Sure not. Cause reasons still not given. To obey and to change point of view are different entities, dont' u think so?
Moreover cause no reason was gived I feel free to have my own explanation:
results of bugged optimized version should be deleted from base and there are no easy way to distinguish results of bugged optimized version and not bugged one. It's just one possibility just for example. Ask to stop use optimized verions for awhile sure doesnt mean they are bad at whole.
I wonder those who argued that the optimized applications were still OK to run will change their mind now that Bernard has stated it is causing problems, and has more or less asked people to stop
Sure not. Cause reasons still not given. To obey and to change point of view are different entities, dont' u think so?
Moreover cause no reason was gived I feel free to have my own explanation:
results of bugged optimized version should be deleted from base and there are no easy way to distinguish results of bugged optimized version and not bugged one. It's just one possibility just for example. Ask to stop use optimized verions for awhile sure doesnt mean they are bad at whole.
I will REQUOTE Bernard (a developer): We are still busy with digging trough the DB (including the already purged results) for trouble that was caused by these unofficial optimized Apps. Presently this involves re-calculation and careful examination of potentially troublesome results. As long as we are doing this, it would be nice not to add such results to the DB.
They are recalculating them. I hope zeroing them out, is really what they are doing. You are causing more issues than helping by running the optimized application, as Bernard has asked for people to stop, because it has caused issues in the DB, and they have to comb through this by hand and fix things.
I guess you can keep running it, and make them work harder and harder on this, or just comply for now, let them finish (at this rate, with people not complying, they can never finish), and then allow the ability for the optimized applications to be tested and allowed.
"Presently this involves re-calculation and careful examination of potentially troublesome results." <---- from this you can't say if he means all WUs from optimized clients or only some "potentially troublesome", god knows what this means so....
edit: but i agree these clients should be stopped by now, also i think the developers should show some more affords to implement these optimizations into an official versions....
Sure not. Cause reasons still not given. To obey and to change point of view are different entities, dont' u think so?
Moreover cause no reason was gived I feel free to have my own explanation:
results of bugged optimized version should be deleted from base and there are no easy way to distinguish results of bugged optimized version and not bugged one. It's just one possibility just for example. Ask to stop use optimized verions for awhile sure doesnt mean they are bad at whole.
Raistmer,
Please understand that anyone continuing to use Akosf optimised clients is causing the project serious problems, for at least several reasons, as follows:
1. The validity of the results may be in doubt. This could mean that unless everyone makes an effort to stop using the optimised clients then all the work everyone is doing will be as much use scientifically as an ashtray on a motorbike!
2. The project team are spending time finding results that have been crunched using the optimised client, and deleting them. Surely you will agree that given their budgetary constraints, this is a complete waste of their time.
3. When the project team id all the results crunched using optimized clients, any credit you get for the same may be deleted. Not a big issue for me, but it may be for some, particularly if you continue crunching using the opt apps for an extended period. When this happens, please do NOT come crying on this BB!
First, I think you are all jumping down Raistmer throat a little prematurely here. There's no indication in his results that he's running S5 optimized (unless he's hacked it himself without identifying it as such). Since his profile indicates he's from Russia, one should assume English is not his native tongue, and after re-reading his posts here several times my take is he is more interested in getting some information on exactly what the problem is, since from our POV the results looked the same.
Secondly, I came across a post from Dr. Allen in the Dev mail lists:
Without reading too much into a very brief post, I think it's safe to say he doesn't see a problem with dealing with "unapproved" apps at the server side if the need arises.
Finally, whereas Bernd's brief reply in this thread had a definitely "ominous" tone about it, hyperbolizing that into potential draconian punative measures that may or may not have their basis in reality is less than useful.
In summation, I really do hope that Dr. Allen and/or Bernd can find the time to write something as a post for the S5 info thread just to give some closure to this whole episode, but it's not the end of world as we know it if they have more important things to address in the short term.
I hope zeroing them out, is really what they are doing.
And I hope they are busy with more important and useful things.
Quote:
You are causing more issues than helping by running the optimized application, as Bernard has asked for people to stop, because it has caused issues in the DB, and they have to comb through this by hand and fix things.
Hey, stop a little and see my results before to blame me.
I _obey_ rules. But sure wanna know what reasons for such rules exists.
Quote:
1. The validity of the results may be in doubt. This could mean that unless everyone makes an effort to stop using the optimised clients then all the work everyone is doing will be as much use scientifically as an ashtray on a motorbike!
2. The project team are spending time finding results that have been crunched using the optimised client, and deleting them. Surely you will agree that given their budgetary constraints, this is a complete waste of their time.
3. When the project team id all the results crunched using optimized clients, any credit you get for the same may be deleted. Not a big issue for me, but it may be for some, particularly if you continue crunching using the opt apps for an extended period. When this happens, please do NOT come crying on this BB!
Yes, sure. _if_ results are bad. And it's a question we should carry comprehensive investigation.
to Alinator Thanx for support :) You are right in both cases: I wanna more info and english is not my native language (i try, i try... :) ).
Quote:
unless he's hacked it himself without identifying it as such
No, I didnt'. I use official one now, after S5 started. But sure I wanna get most from my PCs as it was before.
P.S.
Quote:
3. When the project team id all the results crunched using optimized clients, any credit you get for the same may be deleted. Not a big issue for me, but it may be for some, particularly if you continue crunching using the opt apps for an extended period. When this happens, please do NOT come crying on this BB!
Ah, f..d credits mentioned, I missed it at first reading. Who cares! Just see what these damn credits did with SETI :(
Ok, originally I think I was told that once S5 started I wouldn't have to do anything to stop using the Akosf's optimized apps. (I d/l the C41.01? i think and the C38?? something or other for my older machine about 1 month ago. I have never added any 'patches' and don't use BOINC altered app.
Does this mean I need to uninstall them somehow and reattach to the project?
Thanks.
Founder of BOINC group, Objectivists, a group of philosophically minded rational data crunchers.
Ok, originally I think I was told that once S5 started I wouldn't have to do anything to stop using the Akosf's optimized apps. (I d/l the C41.01? i think and the C38?? something or other for my older machine about 1 month ago. I have never added any 'patches' and don't use BOINC altered app.
Does this mean I need to uninstall them somehow and reattach to the project?
Thanks.
No, if you were running Akos S4 apps you got the the official S5 app the first time you were assigned an S5 result.
You only have to take action if you had applied one of the experimental S5 patches after that.
If you had used a file app_info.xml for your Albert WUs, you need to stop BOINC, delete that app_info.xml and the Einstein project client and then restart BOINC.
If you never downloaded a specific einstein_S5R1 program, you already have the stock client program.
This workunit looks as if you already had the right Einstein client everything is fine on that box.
RE: I wonder those who
)
Sure not. Cause reasons still not given. To obey and to change point of view are different entities, dont' u think so?
Moreover cause no reason was gived I feel free to have my own explanation:
results of bugged optimized version should be deleted from base and there are no easy way to distinguish results of bugged optimized version and not bugged one. It's just one possibility just for example. Ask to stop use optimized verions for awhile sure doesnt mean they are bad at whole.
RE: RE: I wonder those
)
I will REQUOTE Bernard (a developer):
We are still busy with digging trough the DB (including the already purged results) for trouble that was caused by these unofficial optimized Apps. Presently this involves re-calculation and careful examination of potentially troublesome results. As long as we are doing this, it would be nice not to add such results to the DB.
They are recalculating them. I hope zeroing them out, is really what they are doing. You are causing more issues than helping by running the optimized application, as Bernard has asked for people to stop, because it has caused issues in the DB, and they have to comb through this by hand and fix things.
I guess you can keep running it, and make them work harder and harder on this, or just comply for now, let them finish (at this rate, with people not complying, they can never finish), and then allow the ability for the optimized applications to be tested and allowed.
"Presently this involves
)
"Presently this involves re-calculation and careful examination of potentially troublesome results." <---- from this you can't say if he means all WUs from optimized clients or only some "potentially troublesome", god knows what this means so....
edit: but i agree these clients should be stopped by now, also i think the developers should show some more affords to implement these optimizations into an official versions....
RE: RE: Sure not. Cause
)
Raistmer,
Please understand that anyone continuing to use Akosf optimised clients is causing the project serious problems, for at least several reasons, as follows:
1. The validity of the results may be in doubt. This could mean that unless everyone makes an effort to stop using the optimised clients then all the work everyone is doing will be as much use scientifically as an ashtray on a motorbike!
2. The project team are spending time finding results that have been crunched using the optimised client, and deleting them. Surely you will agree that given their budgetary constraints, this is a complete waste of their time.
3. When the project team id all the results crunched using optimized clients, any credit you get for the same may be deleted. Not a big issue for me, but it may be for some, particularly if you continue crunching using the opt apps for an extended period. When this happens, please do NOT come crying on this BB!
FD
Couple of points
)
Couple of points here:
First, I think you are all jumping down Raistmer throat a little prematurely here. There's no indication in his results that he's running S5 optimized (unless he's hacked it himself without identifying it as such). Since his profile indicates he's from Russia, one should assume English is not his native tongue, and after re-reading his posts here several times my take is he is more interested in getting some information on exactly what the problem is, since from our POV the results looked the same.
Secondly, I came across a post from Dr. Allen in the Dev mail lists:
http://www.ssl.berkeley.edu/pipermail/boinc_dev/2006-July/005938.html
Without reading too much into a very brief post, I think it's safe to say he doesn't see a problem with dealing with "unapproved" apps at the server side if the need arises.
Finally, whereas Bernd's brief reply in this thread had a definitely "ominous" tone about it, hyperbolizing that into potential draconian punative measures that may or may not have their basis in reality is less than useful.
In summation, I really do hope that Dr. Allen and/or Bernd can find the time to write something as a post for the S5 info thread just to give some closure to this whole episode, but it's not the end of world as we know it if they have more important things to address in the short term.
Alinator
RE: I hope zeroing them
)
And I hope they are busy with more important and useful things.
Hey, stop a little and see my results before to blame me.
I _obey_ rules. But sure wanna know what reasons for such rules exists.
Yes, sure. _if_ results are bad. And it's a question we should carry comprehensive investigation.
to Alinator Thanx for support :) You are right in both cases: I wanna more info and english is not my native language (i try, i try... :) ).
No, I didnt'. I use official one now, after S5 started. But sure I wanna get most from my PCs as it was before.
P.S.
Ah, f..d credits mentioned, I missed it at first reading. Who cares! Just see what these damn credits did with SETI :(
Ok, originally I think I was
)
Ok, originally I think I was told that once S5 started I wouldn't have to do anything to stop using the Akosf's optimized apps. (I d/l the C41.01? i think and the C38?? something or other for my older machine about 1 month ago. I have never added any 'patches' and don't use BOINC altered app.
Does this mean I need to uninstall them somehow and reattach to the project?
Thanks.
Founder of BOINC group, Objectivists, a group of philosophically minded rational data crunchers.
RE: Ok, originally I think
)
No, if you were running Akos S4 apps you got the the official S5 app the first time you were assigned an S5 result.
You only have to take action if you had applied one of the experimental S5 patches after that.
HTH,
Alinator
If you had used a file
)
If you had used a file app_info.xml for your Albert WUs, you need to stop BOINC, delete that app_info.xml and the Einstein project client and then restart BOINC.
If you never downloaded a specific einstein_S5R1 program, you already have the stock client program.
This workunit looks as if you already had the right Einstein client everything is fine on that box.
RE: to Alinator Thanx for
)
LOL, no problemo! :-)
One thing's for sure though, I'm positive your English is far better than my Russian. ;-)
Alinator