Is Sun a binary system?

Jonas Skendelis
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I've heard an interesting idea that our Sun could have a companion star [ often referenced as Nemesis ], red or brown dwarf, - what makes our system as binary star system. WISE mission scans a sky in IR range.
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What is the current status of that hypothesis?

Bikeman (Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein)
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Is Sun a binary system?

Hi!

AFAIK the puzzle is still unsolved. The WISE survey data (or a first part of it) will be delivered to the science community this spring, and to the public in 2012. If "Nemesis" exists and it's a red dwarf, WISE has a good chance of seeing it, so a non-detection by WISE will cast some doubt on the red dwarf hypothesis.

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ulenz
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As far a s I know NEMESIS is

As far a s I know NEMESIS is considered to be a BROWN dwarf and not a red one. Would the project be able to detect a brown dwarf? In my opinion this is not possible.

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Bikeman (Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein)
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RE: As far a s I know

Quote:
As far a s I know NEMESIS is considered to be a BROWN dwarf and not a red one. Would the project be able to detect a brown dwarf? In my opinion this is not possible.

Hi!

Some suggested it could be a red dwarf as well. If it's a brown dwarf, it go go undetected by WISE.

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Matt Giwer
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RE: I've heard an

Quote:
I've heard an interesting idea that our Sun could have a companion star [ often referenced as Nemesis ], red or brown dwarf, - what makes our system as binary star system. WISE mission scans a sky in IR range.
.
What is the current status of that hypothesis?

Still in cranksville where it came from so far as I can tell.

There has never been anything the idea is supposed to answer save to explain mysterious ancient catastrophes that exist only in the mind of amateurs intent on a mystical interpretation of history and "explaining" the bible.

One really simple question is how long can a companion star's "year" be, how far from the sun can it go, before it is perturbed by other stars and maybe goes off with one? If it shows up tomorrow it is at least 6000 years unless you want it to have caused Noah's flood which of course never happened so there is nothing to explain.

If it is a hypothesis there has to be some data which nothing else can explain. There is nothing in real history which needs such an explanation. There is nothing found in archaeology or geology which needs such an explanation.

Note the emphasis on real history. There is a lot of nonsense out there that is imaginary history. It appears to come from a belief that the magical tales in the bible are real history therefore real history is magical. If I were to say that Baghdad was covered by 100 feet of flood water very few are going to believe me without verification. If I say ancient Babylon was covered by 1000 feet of flood water as was prophesied by Daniel a disturbingly large number of people will believe me particularly if I quote an obscure verse mentioning water from the Book of Daniel and even better if I misquote it.

Erik
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@Bikeman: In this article it

@Bikeman: In this article it states "part of the WISE mission is to search for brown dwarfs, and NASA expects it could find one thousand of the dim stellar objects within 25 light years of our solar system." Why do you believe that WISE would not be able to find any?

@Giwer: What's the point of dragging religion into this discussion? No mention of it before and no need for it here at all.

Matt Giwer
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RE: @Giwer: What's the

Quote:
@Giwer: What's the point of dragging religion into this discussion? No mention of it before and no need for it here at all.

I find it useful to introduce the "intellectual" origins of ideas when discussing ideas. In this case apocalyptic notions most always have their origins in religion even if those origins have become obscured over the years.

Perhaps I could have made it shorter by bringing up the grand-daddy of them all, Velikovsky, which is still commonly discussed and is equally bringing in religion if you insist upon calling it that.

This Nemesis thing also shows up as Nibiru and lately they have been in connection with 2012 and the mesoamericans who should have used a bigger rock.

ulenz
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Matt Giwer: You should read

Matt Giwer:
You should read yourself "The Nemesis Affair" by David Raup. Raup is teaching geophysics and evolutionary biology at the university of Chicago and not a "New Age guru" or someone like that. In his book you can find all datas his theory is based on.
The ancient myths about a "black sun" (religious symbol: swastika) may be related to the black holes in the centre of each galaxy, but not necessarily. And who told people in the stone ages about such things?

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Matt Giwer
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RE: Matt Giwer: You should

Quote:
Matt Giwer:
You should read yourself "The Nemesis Affair" by David Raup. Raup is teaching geophysics and evolutionary biology at the university of Chicago and not a "New Age guru" or someone like that. In his book you can find all datas his theory is based on.

Neither the review

http://www.amazon.com/Nemesis-Affair-Story-Dinosaurs-Science/dp/0393319180

nor the summary

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/hercolobus/esp_hercolobus_47.htm

indicate it is his theory nor the credentials you attribute to him but in any event he is not using any credentials in connection with this book.

Quote:
The ancient myths about a "black sun" (religious symbol: swastika) may be related to the black holes in the centre of each galaxy, but not necessarily. And who told people in the stone ages about such things?

Lets see, double the distance from the sun and quadruple the length of the year. Divide the period of this nemesis thing by four and multiply by 9.2e7 miles and divide by 6e12 miles/light-year. The issue is a supposed 2.6e7 year "periodicity" of extinction events or 4.5e6 Astronomical Units which looks to me like this star would be 69 light years from the sun if it had a circular orbit. At such a distance the gravitational influence of the sun would be indistinguishable from any other star and thus nothing to maintain an orbit. Desiring a highly elliptical orbit would put the perihelion on the order 2x69 ly.

How does this make any sense at all? Even if I dropped a decimal place the same question applies.

ulenz
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Matt Giwer: What is so

Matt Giwer:
What is so curious about a brown dwarf, which crosses the asteroid belts at the outer border of our solar system deflecting asteroids and comets by its gravitational power?
And who tells us that your calculation concerning the possible orbit of NEMESIS is right ?

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Bikeman (Heinz-Bernd Eggenstein)
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RE: @Bikeman: In this

Quote:
@Bikeman: In this article it states "part of the WISE mission is to search for brown dwarfs, and NASA expects it could find one thousand of the dim stellar objects within 25 light years of our solar system." Why do you believe that WISE would not be able to find any?

I can't remember where I got that idea but it is rubbish: You are right, WISE would have a very good chance to catch even a brown dwarf "Sun b".

As for the discussion about the seriousness of the "Nemesis" hypothesis:

I think this article might be informative: (http://www.astrobio.net/exclusive/3427/getting-wise-about-nemesis

It does list some "real" scientists who are willing to consider the possibility of a companion red of brown dwarf to our sun. E.g. the article cites that Richard Muller proposes a "Nemesis" at a distance of ca 1.5 ly from the sun and still gravitationally bound to it, while another scientist, John Matese, suggests a distance of just 1/3 ly.

Looking back, many scientists seem to regret that the speculative companion star of the sun is now so closely linked to the idea of a "bringer of mass extinction", and have even suggested to give it (if it exists :-) !) a less emotional name: "Tyche", to take this doomsday aura off this proposed object.

CU
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