Anti matter question.

adrianxw
adrianxw
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--- It is possible to have

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It is possible to have regions of pure a and pure b to separate out of a binary mixture randomly. But according to the rules of probability I learned the frequency such regions is a function of Exp[-(linear size)^2/(some constant)]. So there should be many more small domains than large ones.
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Does that not assume that a and b are ambivalent towards each other? If a and b are exclusive and anihilate then regions which had a more even distribution of a and b would rapidly reduce to "empty" and regions that had a slight preponderence of either, will be left as almost exclusively a or b after a while. Isolated domains. I know I am probably not explaining this well, but it seemed to me that a concentrated soup of a and b would reduce quite quickly to a very rareified volume, but "sorted" into a and b domains.

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I suggest this link WMAP
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I'm still exploring that site and it's links. Very interesting. Thank You!

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The various region would spread out and overlap. In this case annilating each other.
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Why? If these domains of a and b are now surrounded by large volumes of nothing, (the a and b having anihilated), surely if both a and b feel gravity in the same way, they may just as well condense.

Your last paragraph lost me somewhat, but I think I'll return to that when I have read around the WMAP material, which seems relevent.

Ben:

Welcome to the "Worley model" destruction thread!

I accept that anti-matter feels gravity in the same way as matter. My suggestion that it might not was not thought through, I was kind of caught up in the hysteria of the moment - this happens I'm afraid.

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Mark has already pointed out the issues of the nonzero density of the intergalactic medium, not to mention galaxies colliding.
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Yes, but not really in a convincing way. I know galaxies collide, I mentioned it above somewhere, but the point I made was that galaxy collisions happen within galactic cluster, they do not occur between members of different clusters. If a galaxy cluster formed in an "a" domain, then it is quite reasonable that these galaxies could interact without anihilating. As for the "interdomain" regions, I am happy that they do not produce Gamma emissions, because in my model, the interdomain regions would be empty.

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And then there are cosmic rays....
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... yes, I know there are. But what does that introduce? If the suggestion is that cosmic ray particles have crossed between domains, then you'd expect some of these particles to be a and some to be b. Are you saying that all cosmic ray particles are matter? If that is true, AND if it can be proven that all cosmic ray particles must have come from other domains, AND if it could be shown that the anti-matter cosmic rays would survive well into a matter domain, then that kills my theory, but there are a couple of big if's in there.

The rest of your post is interesting as well, but tends to lie beyond my current worries.

I appreciate you guys bothering with this, I really do.

Wave upon wave of demented avengers march cheerfully out of obscurity into the dream.

MarkF
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adrianxw Perhaps an analogy

adrianxw
Perhaps an analogy will help. If I have billiards table and at first dump five marbles on. After they all stop moving I dump in a sixth chances are good that it will come to rest without touching any of the other five. Now I remove the marbles and repeat the experiment with pool balls the chances are much higher that the sixth pool ball will touch one of the other five before it comes to rest. Now I remove the pool balls and replace them with softballs again the probability of the sixth ball touching one of the other before it comes to rest goes up. Now I remove the pool balls and replace them with soccer balls it is almost certain that the sixth soccer ball will touch one of the other five before coming to rest.

The size of galaxies versus their average separation and the size of galaxy cluster versus their separation put would be most like conducting my little experiment with softballs. Galaxies, galaxy cluster and super clusters of course do not come to rest but continue moving and exchanging components.

It should also be noted that galaxy cluster are not comprised of just their bright components. This picture of the Perseus Cluster shows that the space between the component galaxies is filled with gas.

MarkF
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RE: Does that not assume

Quote:
Does that not assume that a and b are ambivalent towards each other? If a and b are exclusive and anihilate then regions which had a more even distribution of a and b would rapidly reduce to "empty" and regions that had a slight preponderence of either, will be left as almost exclusively a or b after a while. Isolated domains. I know I am probably not explaining this well, but it seemed to me that a concentrated soup of a and b would reduce quite quickly to a very rareified volume, but "sorted" into a and b domains.


Ok, but in that case where did all of the radiation go?

Quote:
Why? If these domains of a and b are now surrounded by large volumes of nothing, (the a and b having anihilated), surely if both a and b feel gravity in the same way, they may just as well condense.


Some of the contents would shrink into stars and galaxies but the system as whole would spread out. It would be the only way to conserve the total energy of the system.

MarkF
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adrianxw With a few

adrianxw
With a few modifications your picture of equal amount of matter and anti-matter is close to what cosmologist believe happened in the first half hour or so of the universe. The main point of difference is that all happen to fast for even small domains of anti-matter to form. By the time the universe was 1/100 of a second old the only form of anti-matter left was positrons and anti-neutrinos. Over the next half hour all the positrons where annihilated and according the WMAP site 379,000 years (sorry for my earlier much larger number taken from an older source) later finally cooled enough to allow atoms to form. The radiation released to flow freely across the universe is what we are observing 13,000,000,000 years later as the cosmic micro-wave background (cooled from 3000K to 2.7K).

It is somewhat out dated now but I would still recommend reading Steven Weinberg's small book 'The First Three Minutes'.

Nereid
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Taking just this part of the

Taking just this part of the para:
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Are you saying that all cosmic ray particles are matter? If that is true, AND if it can be proven that all cosmic ray particles must have come from other domains, AND if it could be shown that the anti-matter cosmic rays would survive well into a matter domain, then that kills my theory, but there are a couple of big if's in there.
- - - - -
If you found the WMAP pages interesting, you'll love reading up on cosmic rays!

In a nutshell, your 'three ifs' is much too simplistic; the composition of CRs changes with energy (and source); with the possible exception of the very highest energy ('galactic') CRs, you can't tell where they came from (source) by looking at where the came from (part of the sky), because the 'local' magnetic fields scramble the paths; however, TeV gammas (detected by 'observatories' such as CANGAROO and H.E.S.S.) seem to suggest that we do have a good handle on sources.

BTW, have you heard the term 'blazar'? When you look at one (you need a telescope, the brightest is way too faint to see with your naked eye), you are looking right down the barrel of an awesome 'gun' which fires 'matter bullets' (and TeV gammas, and ...) right at you. No annihilation gamma signature though; ergo, not much anti-matter about.

Maurice Sherman
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Antimatter is a relevant part

Antimatter is a relevant part of the cosmos. It is a part of the universe that makes up for the invisible areas or voids in space. Space although looks empty is inhabited by particles of antimatter and cosmic rays. The cosmic rays have influence throught all dimensional time and space ( including the antimatter). If we can say that antimatter is a part of the dimensions and can define its roles and interactions between these dimensions of existency and membranes. There are 11 dimensions known. Space is empty to natural eye or on the visible spectrum. Since antimatter takes up the remaining space in the universe (since only a small part of the universe is inhabited by things that can be defined as matter. Matter is anything that takes up space and has mass. Antimatter might not have any mass, but it takes up space to make it seem that there are voids of darkness rather than that space is filled up by an unusual class of matter. Therfore we can say that antimatter although, doesn't have mass it takes space of regular matter in the universe.

Solomon
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RE: Antimatter is a

Message 21881 in response to message 21880

Quote:
Antimatter is a relevant part of the cosmos. It is a part of the universe that makes up for the invisible areas or voids in space. Space although looks empty is inhabited by particles of antimatter and cosmic rays. The cosmic rays have influence throught all dimensional time and space ( including the antimatter). If we can say that antimatter is a part of the dimensions and can define its roles and interactions between these dimensions of existency and membranes. There are 11 dimensions known. Space is empty to natural eye or on the visible spectrum. Since antimatter takes up the remaining space in the universe (since only a small part of the universe is inhabited by things that can be defined as matter. Matter is anything that takes up space and has mass. Antimatter might not have any mass, but it takes up space to make it seem that there are voids of darkness rather than that space is filled up by an unusual class of matter. Therfore we can say that antimatter although, doesn't have mass it takes space of regular matter in the universe.

I'm afraid this is wholly incorrect. The nature of antimatter is such that if all of "empty" space were filled with it, it would annihilate with whatever ordinary matter passed through it. It is simply not possible for large quantities of matter and antimatter to coexist for long periods of time. Furthermore, if there were regions with both, we would see very intense radiation originating there, due to the annihilations.

Here's how you can think about antimatter. For every type of matter particle (electrons, quarks, etc.) there is a type of anti-particle which is opposite in all of its intrinsic properties other than mass, which is the same. So, for example electrons have an antiparticle called a "positron." Positrons have the same mass as electrons, but opposite electric charge and lepton number.

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