You have selected to receive work from other applications if no work is available for the applications you selected

Gary Roberts
Gary Roberts
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RE: If there's only a file

Message 84231 in response to message 84226

Quote:
If there's only a file to update or create to run the WUs faster, I'm game.

Take a look at the sticky thread and realise that you have to assemble apps as well as an appropriate app_info.xml file.

I have updated the thread so that the Windows app_info file is now suitable for someone (like you) running the 4.26 app previously. The opening message of the sticky thread lists precisely the executable files you will need. You will have the 6.04 files already. You will just need the 4.46 test app package that you can get from the beta test page. You will need to replace the app_info file in the beta test package with the one from the sticky thread.

The steps you need to follow are:-

  • * Place my app_info.xml plus the 4.46 apps into your EAH project directory.
    * Double check what you have against the list in the sticky thread.
    * Double check that the 6.04 new apps (as listed) are there as well.
    * Stop BOINC completely (confirm with task manager)
    * Restart BOINC.

That's it.

Whatever task was in progress at the time you stopped BOINC will be restarted again where it left off. Bad things will happen if any files are missing or if you make an error cutting and pasting the app_info.xml file. If you are careful you should have no problem. The responsibility is yours however :-).

Cheers,
Gary.

Ralph
Ralph
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I'm unsure where the 'host

Message 84232 in response to message 84227


I'm unsure where the 'host summary' page is, but if it's the 'Your results' button off the Projects menu, then yes, they match.

I have both SSR3 and SSR4 units in my list and the SSR4 are running now.
I did forget to mention that I have BOINC running as a service in Vista Ultimate.

Quote:

OK, here's the official documentation from Berkeley, and here's the Unoffcial BOINC Wiki write up about it.

One thing to be clear about is that using the AP means that you have the core client in full manual mode when it comes to updating the science applications. So you have to keep an eye on the project home page and fora to make sure you stay up to date.

As far as using it now here at EAH, there aren't any new power apps for new science run just starting, but as mentioned earlier, if you wanted to you could use it to run the R3 Power App to give it a test drive so to speak as long as there are 'clean up' tasks to do as the old run winds down.

BTW, thanks for posting back with some more details about your setup. I do have couple questions for you.

The first is does the number of the tasks assigned by the project and showing on your Host Summary page equal the number of EAH tasks shown in BOINC Manager?

If the answer to that is yes, then has the host started running any of the S5R4 tasks yet? You can tell them apart since SxRy is always part of the file name.

If the answer to both is yes, then I guess it's safe to say if you can ignore the log message about application selection the project is sending when running stock.

Alinator


Ralph
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OK, I'd like to ask from a

OK, I'd like to ask from a 'newbie' standpoint.
I have some technical and even a little programming background, but I don't seem to find certain information.

From what I understand from a quick look around, in simple language, there's a way to speed up processing.

I need to create a file (app_info?) to tell BOINC to use a specific program for specific work units. I need to locate and install the app, and download the work units for that app. Am I missing anything?

I have 64 bit Vista and Intel dual core for the program.
Where do I look for the program, the work units, and the information as to what's available to run?

archae86
archae86
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RE: From what I understand

Message 84234 in response to message 84233

Quote:

From what I understand from a quick look around, in simple language, there's a way to speed up processing.

I need to create a file (app_info?) to tell BOINC to use a specific program for specific work units. I need to locate and install the app, and download the work units for that app. Am I missing anything?


Using a special ap only speeds things up when a special ap is available for your platform that suits current work.

At the moment there are two flavors of current work, S5R3 (over except for cleanup), and S5R4 (very recently started, and will be with us for many months).

Of the two, only S5R3 currently has a special ap of the sort in question for _any_ platform.

So undertaking the extra effort of doing this now will only speed your work on leftovers, if any, and saddles you with the extra burden of keeping up with future possible changes on your own (if you don't use this mechanism the project automatically updates you--bug fixes, performance enhancements, and yet more major revisions).

As to actually doing it, all you need is documented in this thread

Gary Roberts
Gary Roberts
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Whilst archae86 has more than

Message 84235 in response to message 84233

Whilst archae86 has more than adequately answered this, I'll add my bit just in case it helps further.

Quote:
From what I understand from a quick look around, in simple language, there's a way to speed up processing.

Yes, by choosing to run a more optimised app than the standard (stock) one. The advantage of the stock app is that staying up-to-date happens automatically but usually at a much later time than when the optimised apps become available. In the run just completed, the stock app (4.26) never did get updated to the best possible app (4.46) so people who chose manual intervention did contribute more efficiently for quite a long time.

In the newly started S5R4 run, the stock apps are the only ones available. They are essentially the best optimised apps from the previous run. There is no new further optimised app on the horizon yet but we could possibly reach that stage in a couple of months.

So why bother with the AP mechanism at all? The only reason is to crunch the remaining S5R3 tasks more efficiently than you would otherwise do. On the server status page (linked on the home page) you can actually see how many WUs for S5R3 are still out there. The current number is 61K. A WU consists of two successful tasks that need to be returned by two separate hosts. Probably most of the outstanding WUs only have 1 task outstanding but some will have two. So the total outstanding tasks is somewhere between 61K and 122K.

This number will steadily decrease but there will be a few bumps along the road. A fraction of the outstandings will not ever be returned so that more tasks will need to be generated as time progresses to replace them. My thinking is that if one of my machines receives tasks from this resend pool, I want to crunch it with the best optimised app available. The only way to do that is to choose manually.

I also see evidence that if my host is announcing to the scheduler that it can accept R3 tasks, there is a greater chance the scheduler will send it a suitable one. I've seen a few of my hosts receive multiple R3 tasks that the scheduler had been "sitting on" for a few hours, seemingly waiting for the appropriate host to come along and make a request. If the scheduler wasn't discriminating like this, the resends would always go out quickly to whatever host came along first. Quite a bit of bandwidth is saved if resends are sent to suitably equipped hosts.

Quote:
I need to create a file (app_info?) to tell BOINC to use a specific program for specific work units. I need to locate and install the app, and download the work units for that app. Am I missing anything?

You need to create your own app_info.xml by cutting and pasting exactly as described in the sticky thread. I have already modified the Windows example so that it will work for you. That file you create will tell BOINC about the apps to be used. You need to visit the beta test page (linked on the home page) and get the Windows 4.46 zip archive which contains all the apps that you need as listed in the sticky thread. You DO NOT need to download any tasks (work units) as they aren't special and BOINC will get what is on offer automatically. Please note that I haven't further mentioned the version 6.04 apps because they are already in your EAH project directory. Simply confirm to yourself that they are there and don't delete any other app files that might also be there.

Quote:
I have 64 bit Vista and Intel dual core for the program.
Where do I look for the program, the work units, and the information as to what's available to run?

Please reread the answers in this thread and the sticky thread that archae86 linked to. If this information doesn't make sense, you would be better just letting BOINC handle things automatically.

Cheers,
Gary.

MarkJ
MarkJ
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Something else strange that I

Something else strange that I noticed in the logs related to all this.

12/08/2008 11:25:09 PM|Einstein@Home|Sending scheduler request: To fetch work. Requesting 9011 seconds of work, reporting 0 completed tasks
12/08/2008 11:25:14 PM|Einstein@Home|Scheduler request succeeded: got 1 new tasks
12/08/2008 11:25:14 PM|Einstein@Home|Message from server: No work can be sent for the applications you have selected
12/08/2008 11:25:14 PM|Einstein@Home|Message from server: You have selected to receive work from other applications if no work is available for the applications you selected
12/08/2008 11:25:14 PM|Einstein@Home|Message from server: Sending work from other applications

12/08/2008 11:26:04 PM|SETI@home|Sending scheduler request: To fetch work. Requesting 428825 seconds of work, reporting 0 completed tasks
12/08/2008 11:26:09 PM|SETI@home|Scheduler request succeeded: got 0 new tasks
12/08/2008 11:27:10 PM|SETI@home|Sending scheduler request: To fetch work. Requesting 428818 seconds of work, reporting 0 completed tasks
12/08/2008 11:27:15 PM|SETI@home|Scheduler request succeeded: got 0 new tasks
12/08/2008 11:27:20 PM|orbit@home|Sending scheduler request: To fetch work. Requesting 214408 seconds of work, reporting 0 completed tasks
12/08/2008 11:27:45 PM|orbit@home|Scheduler request succeeded: got 0 new tasks
12/08/2008 11:28:15 PM|SETI@home|Sending scheduler request: To fetch work. Requesting 428813 seconds of work, reporting 0 completed tasks

It says its giving 1 new task but it doesn't download it. I presume its a S5R3 and doesn't think I have the right app for it. Given I don't have an app_info.xml, shouldn't it give me the "stock" S5R3 app?

archae86
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RE: It says its giving 1

Message 84237 in response to message 84236

Quote:
It says its giving 1 new task but it doesn't download it. I presume its a S5R3 and doesn't think I have the right app for it. Given I don't have an app_info.xml, shouldn't it give me the "stock" S5R3 app?

Many of us (probably all of us) are getting that message, whether or not we are using the anonymous platform mechanism (app_info.xml).

It is annoying but the good news is, despite the worrisome appearance, work is downloaded and gets done.

Alinator
Alinator
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Hmmm... Getting the

Hmmm...

Getting the message is part of an ongoing known issue related to the upgrade of the backend to the newest BOINC software.

However, not being able to download the work (or applications) should not be a problem at this point if you are running stock (at least in theory).

So, what we need to know now is:

1.) Which one of your hosts are you talking about specifically? The reports are you could see this on all hosts, regardless of whether you are using the AP or not.

2.) What is the Task ID and/or Filename of the the one which won't download (preferably both)?

@ Archae86: That's what curious here. Mark says he's running stock, but the log snippet is indicating he not getting the task DL'ed for some reason. Note the repeated requests in quick succession, but the project won't send anything more.

DUHHH.... Alinator!! They are to different projects! Never mind...

Yes, this is could be the ignore the message because it's bogus scenario. Still his last comment doesn't fit the pattern though. :-?

Get more coffee! :-D

Alinator

archae86
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RE: Yes, this is could be

Message 84239 in response to message 84238

Quote:

Yes, this is could be the ignore the message because it's bogus scenario. Still his last comment doesn't fit the pattern though. :-?


I assume, Alinator, you are referring to the comment from MarkJ

Quote:
It says its giving 1 new task but it doesn't download it.


But, MarkJ, all four of your hosts show multiple new tasks sent on 12 August.

Most new task allocations in Einstein don't involve actual file downloads--but the transmission of a few bits telling your host to use files it already has downloaded slightly differently. This does not create the same logging imprint seen on SETI downloads, for example. Checking whether you "really" got fresh work is better done from the task list on the web site or in BOINCMgr than from the log.

These messages are indeed a bit distressing, and plenty of us have misconstrued their import to our hosts at first sight. I still think you are OK.

Bernd Machenschalk
Bernd Machenschalk
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See my post in Problems and

See my post in Problems and Bug Reports.

BM

BM

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