Attacked by astronomers!

tullio
tullio
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RE: What, do you think, is

Message 68282 in response to message 68281

Quote:


What, do you think, is the unique set of astronomical observations that could be made from Arecibo?

'Unique' in the sense that so many astronomical observations can be made only with the HST.

What about 'maybe not unique, but Arecibo is much more effective (or efficient)' than any alternative?

In terms of addressing what you see as the central (astronomy) questions of today, how would you rank those which only Arecibo can do? Which Arecibo can do (significantly) better than any other facility?

I am not a professional astronomer, but I have visited the Arecibo home page and have learned about their work. They have installed a multibeam receiver and other advanced instruments. Maybe their capabilities in radar astronomy could be used to watch Near Earth Objects. Since even older optical telescopes like Mount Wilson and Palomar are still doing useful research even in the era of space telescopes, I see no reason to shut down Arecibo.
Tullio

Nereid
Nereid
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RE: RE: What, do you

Message 68283 in response to message 68282

Quote:
Quote:


What, do you think, is the unique set of astronomical observations that could be made from Arecibo?

'Unique' in the sense that so many astronomical observations can be made only with the HST.

What about 'maybe not unique, but Arecibo is much more effective (or efficient)' than any alternative?

In terms of addressing what you see as the central (astronomy) questions of today, how would you rank those which only Arecibo can do? Which Arecibo can do (significantly) better than any other facility?

I am not a professional astronomer, but I have visited the Arecibo home page and have learned about their work. They have installed a multibeam receiver and other advanced instruments. Maybe their capabilities in radar astronomy could be used to watch Near Earth Objects. Since even older optical telescopes like Mount Wilson and Palomar are still doing useful research even in the era of space telescopes, I see no reason to shut down Arecibo.
Tullio


What I'm trying to get at is an economic question: imagine you are charged with the responsibility of allocating scarce resources to the worldwide (professional) astronomy community. You can't have everything; you have to make tough choices.

How do you go about choosing?

One option is to mothball, or close, older facilities, so freeing up funds (operational if nothing else) that can be used on newer facilities.

How do you decide?

In the real world, facilities are owned by, and funded by, a myriad of agencies, bodies, institutions, etc. Some are completely private; some are under the complete control of government departments or directly managed agencies; some are in between. Some operational funds come from one-off (research) grants; some are part of institutional budgets; some ...

One wonderous thing is that some astronomers at least have worked together to draw up long-range goals and plans, so specific moneys can be allocated in various government budgets, over a long period of time, so as to address what are seen as the high priority science goals ...

Would you like some links to public material on these plans, the processes used to come up with the plans, and so on?

tullio
tullio
Joined: 22 Jan 05
Posts: 1,994
Credit: 32,279,599
RAC: 512

RE: What I'm trying to get

Message 68284 in response to message 68283

Quote:


What I'm trying to get at is an economic question: imagine you are charged with the responsibility of allocating scarce resources to the worldwide (professional) astronomy community. You can't have everything; you have to make tough choices.

How do you go about choosing?

One option is to mothball, or close, older facilities, so freeing up funds (operational if nothing else) that can be used on newer facilities.

How do you decide?

In the real world, facilities are owned by, and funded by, a myriad of agencies, bodies, institutions, etc. Some are completely private; some are under the complete control of government departments or directly managed agencies; some are in between. Some operational funds come from one-off (research) grants; some are part of institutional budgets; some ...

One wonderous thing is that some astronomers at least have worked together to draw up long-range goals and plans, so specific moneys can be allocated in various government budgets, over a long period of time, so as to address what are seen as the high priority science goals ...

Would you like some links to public material on these plans, the processes used to come up with the plans, and so on?


I am always willing to learn. On the Arecibo home page I have read both the NSF Senior Review Recommendations and the replies to it by NAIC, and have found them convincing. What struck me was the fact that Arecibo is one of the only two radar astronomy facilities in the world and, as I wrote, could become important in the detection of the Near Earth Objects. Of course it is none of my business to decide how the astronomical community should spend the available money. I simply expressed my opinion, for what it may be worth.
Tullio

tullio
tullio
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I've read on the NYTimes a

I've read on the NYTimes a fascinating story how about a century old treasure of astronomical images on glass plates is being scanned by a custom made scanner at Harvard Observatory and converted to digitized media for further analysis. This is an example of today's astronomers adapting new techniques to their age old science.
Tullio

Nereid
Nereid
Joined: 9 Feb 05
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Credit: 925,034
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RE: I've read on the

Message 68286 in response to message 68285

Quote:
I've read on the NYTimes a fascinating story how about a century old treasure of astronomical images on glass plates is being scanned by a custom made scanner at Harvard Observatory and converted to digitized media for further analysis. This is an example of today's astronomers adapting new techniques to their age old science.
Tullio


One example of very valuable uses to which the data from the scanned plates can be put are the various NEO pre-covery efforts, for example DANEOPS (http://earn.dlr.de/daneops/).

Given that one of these teams may turn up data that helps give a warning on the next Tunguska (or worse), a potentially very high benefit to cost!

tullio
tullio
Joined: 22 Jan 05
Posts: 1,994
Credit: 32,279,599
RAC: 512

RE: One example of very

Message 68287 in response to message 68286

Quote:

One example of very valuable uses to which the data from the scanned plates can be put are the various NEO pre-covery efforts, for example DANEOPS (http://earn.dlr.de/daneops/).
Given that one of these teams may turn up data that helps give a warning on the next Tunguska (or worse), a potentially very high benefit to cost!

When working as a physics and astronomy editor at Mondadori Publishing House in Milano I published a book by Paolo Maffei, "Monsters in the sky", which covered the Tunguska event in a chapter on comets. The book was later translated into English by Riccardo Giacconi and, I believe, his wife and published by MIT Press. I have read that a group of Italian astronomers and geologists believe to have found a possible impact crater as a small lake and are returning this summer to the site to search for possible fragments of the object, whatever it was.
Tullio

Nereid
Nereid
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Posts: 79
Credit: 925,034
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Another NEO pre-covery team

Another NEO pre-covery team is the Italian lead ANEOPP

Paolo Maffei as in the discoverer of the Maffei Group?

tullio
tullio
Joined: 22 Jan 05
Posts: 1,994
Credit: 32,279,599
RAC: 512

RE: Another NEO pre-covery

Message 68289 in response to message 68288

Quote:

Another NEO pre-covery team is the Italian lead ANEOPP

Paolo Maffei as in the discoverer of the Maffei Group?


Yes, and the author of "Al di la' della Luna" (Beyond the Moon) which I also edited and was translated into English by Father D.J.K. O'Connell, the former director of the Vatican Observatory. It was published by MIT Press in 1979.
Tullio

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